SH67H3 with a Xeon E3-1230 workin'

[tartin]

Slapped this together tonight, final build in a couple of weeks or so.

While I can't get a Sandy Bridge with its' lame Gfx Core castrated off it.

With a Xeon E3-1230, I can at least get a Sandy Bridge that's had a vasectomy.

A few more CPU options for you fella's considering a SH67H3, etc. with a Xeon E3-12x0 CPU instead of a i5 or i7 SNB.

Laterzzz...

[Jacob XP]

interesting.  Didn't even think of a Xeon as a option. I thought you needed a special server mainboard for that.

And the pricing of the E3-1230 is also affordable. Another good thing is max TDP of 80 watt

I will investigate this a bit further.

[tartin]

Yes Jacob,

The 80W non-Gfx Core Xeon's SNB's come in several varieties:

With thanks and acknowledgments to Patrick at Serve the Home.

Intel Xeon E3-1280 fastest Sandy Bridge Benchmarks and Review.
http://www.servethehome.com/intel-xeon-e3-1280-fastest-sandy-bridge-benchmarks-review/



But it's also a heads-up for those who are "limited" to a H67 M/B such as the SH67H3 and presumably the SH67H7, when & if it eventuates.

While those with a P67 & Z68 based M/B's can fully utilize the i7-2600K & i5-2500K CPU's, we with the above Shuttle XPC 's can't.

I chose the E3-1230 for its' price/performance/power consumption (under $250 AU as I write) for the SH67H3 as it serves my requirements well.

Those who need the "Big Iron" CPU's & are limited to the H67 Chipset also can also get the E3-1280 (95W) for similar i7-2600K performance levels, if they can afford it (or their family don't mind going without food & clothing for a month or so).

There are E3-1240 (with 8Mb L3) & E3-1270 which are the i5-2500 & i7-2600 80W TDP non-K equivalents, plus other lower speed & power CPU's as well.

It all comes down to what you want and are willing to pay for.

[Jacob XP]

The SH67H7 has been available in Europe for almost 2 month now. I think the only difference is another design of the case.  But to me the look is important     And I must say the H7 is a prettier, the look is more clean.

SH67H7


SH67H3


About the server CPU  I think most people will be happy with a plain Core i7 2400, 2500 or 2600  The pricing ( especially on the 2400 and 2500 are better than the server cpu. And yes the max TDP is 15 watt higher. But in real life when the computer is running the difference will be lower. Unless you spend all day benchmarking the difference will be minuscule. And if you really want to save a few Euro on your power bill you can get a special Sandy Bridge cpu with only 65 watt TDP.

[tartin]

The SH67H7 has been available in Europe for almost 2 month now. I think the only difference is another design of the case.  But to me the look is important     And I must say the H7 is a prettier, the look is more clean.

About the server CPU  I think most people will be happy with a plain Core i7 2400, 2500 or 2600  The pricing ( especially on the 2400 and 2500 are better than the server cpu. And yes the max TDP is 15 watt higher. But in real life when the computer is running the difference will be lower. Unless you spend all day benchmarking the difference will be minuscule. And if you really want to save a few Euro on your power bill you can get a special Sandy Bridge cpu with only 65 watt TDP.

Hey Jacob,

Hmm, has the SH67H7 been available for two months in Europe?

And they are in stock too?

Are you sure about that?

There is no ETA of shipments of the SH67H7 to the Australian distributor yet.

Anyhow, yeah, as far as front fascia panels go, it's what you like personally.

Me ..., I prefer the G2/H3 facia, I find the drop-down front access panels to be a Right Royal PITA, the 1mm plastic pins are liable to be broken and the flap gets in the road with USB sticks that are are attached to key rings, etc.
The "stealth" optical drive panels does help with the aesthetics though, you are not as limited with the drive choices.

--------------

But back OT,

As to the Xeon option for the SH67H3 & SH67H7, I think you may have missed the point of me posting in regards to those who are "stuck" with the H67 H3's & H7's but would like the best we can get out of it.

Did you have a close look at the benchmarks Patrick did, especially the comparison of the E3-1270 to the i7-2600K and his comments of E3-1270 vs i7-2600 (non-K).

The 19~20W delta's of the equally-clocked CPU's at load are quite significant, ~30% i7-2600K over a E3-1270 = a lot more heat even if you do discard the extra power consumption (Gamers take note).

As far as the low voltage 65W "S" series goes, as Ilya Gavrichenkov, in his review at X-bit labs, Energy-Efficient Sandy Bridge: Intel Core i5-2400S CPU Review:
"However, if you decide to go with Core i5-2400S or any other similar processor from the S-series, you should keep in mind a few things. Most importantly, Intel doesn’t preselect better semiconductor dies for their energy-efficient models, but simply lowers the clock speeds, as simple as that. As a result, Core i5-2400S runs slower than the regular Core i5-2400, and sometimes this difference is substantial and can reach up to 20% under heavy load. However, the energy savings in this case are not that noticeable. Theoretically, the TDP difference between energy-efficient and regular processors is 30 W, but in reality we saw only 12 W at the most in a very limited number of usage scenarios. Moreover, there is simply no difference of any kind during HD video playback or 3D graphics processing."
Link:- http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/core-i5-2400s.html

The i3-2100T 35W with its' HD 1000 GPU is a good low power performer for HTPC use for HD video playback and encoding, but the E3-1260L 45W (if you could get one!) could be a better all-rounder, but I haven't seen any reviews of it yet.

IMO, Bottom line: Apart from the i7-2600K , clock-for-clock, the E3-12xx Xeons are probably the best in terms of features, performance and bin'd quality!


-----------

As an aside, this is my 8th Shuttle, and for the first time the drive cage screw holes actually line-up with chassis brace holes, I must have got lucky

[fighterpilot]

I would have preferred the SH67H7 instead of the H3, but alas I don't know if it will ever make it to the USA, and didn't want to wait any more. In any case, interesting find with the Xeon. I just bought an i5-2400 today, figure it will be sufficient, and should run cooler if not using the IGP one would think. Surprised Intel doesn't publish TDP with IGP active and without, because seems that would make up for the 15W TDP difference. But who knows. All I know is I didn't want to spend $250+ for an i7 and i5-2400 seems best bang for the buck. The other thing that boggles my mind is why turn off hyperthreading? Just so they can charge over $100 more for an i7 chip?

[marcospin]

Hello  ,

I'm thinking to put a E3-1220L + Radeon HD6450 in a SH67H3 , because it's for work and not for gaming .

* Can I use ECC memory ?
* With a future bios update , remain the SH67H3  Xeon compatible ?

@tartin : Have you tried the new bios SH67H000.107  ??

Thx in advance .

Greetings from Antwerp - Belgium .
 

[tartin]

@tartin : Have you tried the new bios SH67H000.107  ??

Yes, updated to 107.

The original 105 recognized the Xeon CPU OK, but when I ran Intel Extreme Tuning Utility, it gave a error message on start-up & seemed to show that the max turbo mode was 3400 MHz not 3600 MHz, so Turbo Mode was not operating correctly.

This would have been for all SNB CPU's that had Turbo Mode 2 capability too I would presume.

Now able to run Intel Extreme Tuning Utility with no problems.

BTW, now able to run GSkill F3-12800CL8D-8GBXM (2x4GB kit) @ 7-7-7-22 using Intel Extreme Tuning Utility (with the H67 chipset we are limited to 1333 MHz, so no 1600 MHz & above unfortunately).

My H3 is a work in progress at the moment with both hardware & software, so it's not being used as a stable working unit at present.

I've customized (read butchered) a Zalman VNF100 passive Video Card cooler for the Galaxy GT 430  I have in it (Full-height, that comes with an excellent oversize Heatsink-Fan), so I can install a ASUS DX Xonar sound card in the PCIe x 1 slot.

Got a lot on at work and with other things demanding my attention at present too.

Here is a pic of some details:

[tartin]

I'm thinking to put a E3-1220L + Radeon HD6450 in a SH67H3 , because it's for work and not for gaming .

* Can I use ECC memory ?
* With a future bios update , remain the SH67H3  Xeon compatible ?

If you could elaborate on what your requirements are, I might be able to help more/point you in the right direction on this.

[tartin]

I would have preferred the SH67H7 instead of the H3, but alas I don't know if it will ever make it to the USA, and didn't want to wait any more. In any case, interesting find with the Xeon. I just bought an i5-2400 today, figure it will be sufficient, and should run cooler if not using the IGP one would think. Surprised Intel doesn't publish TDP with IGP active and without, because seems that would make up for the 15W TDP difference. But who knows. All I know is I didn't want to spend $250+ for an i7 and i5-2400 seems best bang for the buck. The other thing that boggles my mind is why turn off hyperthreading? Just so they can charge over $100 more for an i7 chip?

It would make better financial sense if Shuttle made a SZ68H7 (Z68 chipset) for the "Premium" market and charged ~$100 extra for the privilege, as Intel have done now with this chipset and for that matter all the SNB CPU's.
Appears the Marketing Dept of both Companies has a lot to do with what models are released & when.

Don't know what your H3 looked like FP, but mine was in the first shipment to Australia and it has that "rush to market" look about it.

Production-line "smudge" marks still on the chassis and the ICE fan has the ADDA sticker still on it, that Shuttle usually has replaced with their own.

So anyway, the H7 will probably be eventually released, they would loose-face "heap-um big" in Taiwan IT scene, after all the intro at at 2011 Computex Taipei.

Who knows?

------
BTW, you made the right choice with the i5-2400 rather than i5-2400S, as you would have read in the above quote & link to the review at X-bit labs.

It's hard to say somewhat, because of the way Intel have "arranged" their CPU line-up, but on paper, the Xeon E3-1260L has all the boxes ticked for a low power CPU, with the only negative being its' Max Temp threshold being about 60ºC.

[ontoy]

Tartin,

What is your CPU temp under BIOS, mind is 65C under bios.  But when i check under windows with core temp core 0 to core 3 ranges from 36-42.  Why is the CPU temp so high under BIOS.

[tartin]

Tartin,

What is your CPU temp under BIOS, mind is 65C under bios.  But when i check under windows with core temp core 0 to core 3 ranges from 36-42.  Why is the CPU temp so high under BIOS.

Do you have a SH67H3 too ontoy?

If so, what components do you have installed?
Is the CPU a i5 or a i7?

Anyhow, back to your query.

Facts & figures:
- SH67H3 with Xeon E3-1230, Galaxy GT 430 passive, Smart Fan Mode, room temp ~18°C.
- Boot from cold to CMOS, wait 5 minutes.
    - Readings:     +56 ~ +58
                            1.176 V Vcore
                            980 ~ 1050 RPM CPU fan
- Exit & boot to Windows, starting  HWiNFO64 immediately.
    - Readings  :   Max 38°C , soon after 32°C as current.
                            0.9757 V Vcore
                            918 RPM CPU fan

I don't worry about it too much, as you see from above the CPU is getting fed 1.176V constant while idle in the CMOS, which would equate to about 3000 ~ 3200 MHz (just guessing here), so a temperature of 56°C ~ 58°C seem quite plausible as the CPU is not going into any of its' P States.
So when it gets into Windows and is reportedly running 38°C then down to 32°C very quickly as it throttles back to 0.9757V @ 1600 MHz.
                            
The thing to remember here is, the CPU sensors don't actually report a temperature, they report a distance to TJMax/TJ Target which the firmware of the analogue sensors report as a temperature.
Intel have not been helpful in this, and recently said that the "i" Core CPU's reports a distance to TJ Target which may be equal or higher to TJMax.
Which would appear that they don't know exactly either.
How each Mainboard manufacturer implements the distance to the CPU's max thermal threshold to CPU temperature with the AMI CMOS is unknown.
So, when it all comes down to it, if you know the TJMax/TJ Target for your CPU, all you really need to know is the current distance to it to see how the CPU is copping thermally.

As an aside, I also have another mini-ITX, ASUS P8H67-I Rev 3 with a Xeon E3-1230, Scythe Samurai ZZ CPU Cooler, Galaxy GT 430, in a smaller box than the H3.
If I run the same procedure as above:
- "Standard" CMOS Cooling settings
- Boot from cold to CMOS, wait 5 minutes.
    - Readings:     43°C
                            1.200 V Vcore
                            1534 RPM CPU fan
- Exit & boot to Windows, starting  HWiNFO64 immediately.
    - Readings  :   Max 37°C , soon after 30°C as current.
                            0.9757 V Vcore
                            561 RPM CPU fan
                            
If you are concerned or want to know more, it may pay to post a question to unclewebb on the RealTemp forums (probably the best Windows based temperature reporting proggy's, once configured correctly) at Techpowerup or XtremeSystems.

[marcospin]

core i5 is with EIST but the Xeons is with Intel® Demand Based Switching . what is te difference ?
I suppose the  SH67H3 support Intel® Demand Based Switching :  your Xeon running in idle 1596 MHz .   

[ontoy]

Yes I do, i build it just couple weeks ago.  I just have the bare minimum components right now. 
I-7 2600 Sandy Bridge
16 Gig kingston memory
1 Gig of samsung Hard Drive

Inside Bios: Smart Fan
CPU temp: +63
Vcore: +1.212v
CPU Fan: 1397 RPM

In Windows Temp:

Core 0: 47
Core 1: 43
Core 2: 43
Core 3: 43

So it is normal then for the temp to be higher under bios.

[tartin]

Yes I do, i build it just couple weeks ago.  I just have the bare minimum components right now.  
I-7 2600 Sandy Bridge
16 Gig kingston memory
1 Gig of samsung Hard Drive

Inside Bios: Smart Fan
CPU temp: +63
Vcore: +1.212v
CPU Fan: 1397 RPM

In Windows Temp:

Core 0: 47
Core 1: 43
Core 2: 43
Core 3: 43

So it is normal then for the temp to be higher under bios.

Hey ontoy,

Your temperatures do seem high.

I just put in a i7-2600 like yours.

- SH67H3 with i7-2600, Galaxy GT 430 passive, Smart Fan Mode, room temp ~15°C.
- Boot from cold to CMOS, wait 5 minutes.
    - Readings:     +57
                            1.212 V Vcore
                            1055 RPM CPU fan
- Exit & boot to Windows, starting  HWiNFO64 immediately.
    - Readings  :   Ranges 25°C  to 28°C  across the four cores at idle.
                            0.9707 V Vcore
                            919 RPM CPU fan

Looks like this i7-2600 is a good one

My ambient room temperature must be taken into account. It is Winter here in Australia.

Tightening the Shuttle CPU Heatsink screws too hard can sometimes lead to high temps, I just do a X-Cross, half a turn at a time, using just thumb, fore & middle fingers with the Phillips head screwdriver, and stop when each comes "hard-up-a-stop".
There is a lot more force being applied with these Shuttle ICE Heatsinks than the plastic pin type.
Just using Arctic Silver Ceramiue thermal paste.

Edit:
Some part of the higher Windows temps could be the on-chip Gfx, not sure though, just a thought.
Here's some pic's I should have posted:

[tartin]

core i5 is with EIST but the Xeons is with Intel® Demand Based Switching . what is te difference ?
I suppose the  SH67H3 support Intel® Demand Based Switching :  your Xeon running in idle 1596 MHz .   

These SNB Xeons are all EIST, have a look at the HWiNFO64 Features section in one of my previous posts.

[fighterpilot]

Yes I do, i build it just couple weeks ago.  I just have the bare minimum components right now. 
I-7 2600 Sandy Bridge
16 Gig kingston memory
1 Gig of samsung Hard Drive

Inside Bios: Smart Fan
CPU temp: +63
Vcore: +1.212v
CPU Fan: 1397 RPM

In Windows Temp:

Core 0: 47
Core 1: 43
Core 2: 43
Core 3: 43

So it is normal then for the temp to be higher under bios.

I have an i5-2400 and with ambient room temp of about 24C, my CPU at idle are low to mid 40's. But peak doesn't exceed 70C, usually mid to upper 60's.

[marcospin]

so , my sh67h3 is running fine , not a single problem
cpu Xeon E3-1220L
8 GB ( 4 x 2GB )  memory ECC (Kingston)
Radeon HD 6450
first bios 1.06 , now bios 1.09

with greetings , from Belgium .

[marcospin]

just one thing is not working as it should : the front USB 3 ports .
With a USB mouse , USB 2 Harddisk , ... they are ok .
With a USB 3 Harddisk not ; the pc hangs in the bios while booting .
The rear USB 3 ports are ok .

with greetings from Belgium

[Sklathill]

I've customized (read butchered) a Zalman VNF100 passive Video Card cooler for the Galaxy GT 430  I have in it (Full-height, that comes with an excellent oversize Heatsink-Fan), so I can install a ASUS DX Xonar sound card in the PCIe x 1 slot.

First time on this forum in forever...!

I'd love to know more about how you got that VNF100 in there.  I've got two of the Zalman coolers on a pair of Radeon 4670 cards.  They used to be in my SN68SG2 cases, but I recently got an SH67H3, and I really would like to not have to rely on my on board video for the time being...!

[tartin]

I've customized (read butchered) a Zalman VNF100 passive Video Card cooler for the Galaxy GT 430  I have in it (Full-height, that comes with an excellent oversize Heatsink-Fan), so I can install a ASUS DX Xonar sound card in the PCIe x 1 slot.

First time on this forum in forever...!

I'd love to know more about how you got that VNF100 in there.  I've got two of the Zalman coolers on a pair of Radeon 4670 cards.  They used to be in my SN68SG2 cases, but I recently got an SH67H3, and I really would like to not have to rely on my on board video for the time being...!

Hi Sklathill,

Replied to your email.

A picture paints a thousand words" and I'll post some digital photos of my SH67H3 setup with the "chopped" Zalman VNF100.
 
I'll try to do it soon but it could be next Tuesday before I can do that as I will need to pull it apart and take some measurements of the "cut" mod, etc. and the SH67H3 is in use at present.
 
The way I did it works for the Galaxy GT430 as it is only about 140mm long, though this mod "just-fits" in the SH67H3.
 
It MAY work with a longer card, but the condenser-pipe/fins arrangement would need to be different to what I did.
 
Briefly, I "chopped" the Zalman fins into two, but unequal parts, so that one part has two of the condenser pipes and the other just one.
 
The pipes are mounted horizontally, the GPU heatsink rotated 90° clockwise, with the two-pipe section around to the back of the card and the single-pipe section is  "hanging-out", at approximately 45° to the horizontal, in the air space between the drive cage and the ICE fan.
 
The photos will show it better.
 
The temperatures for this GT430 card are generally 20~25°C above the ambient room temperature.
 
Get back to you soon.

[tartin]

As promised Sklathill.

Phone camera "happy snaps" unfortunately.

1. Cover off, as she runs.



2. From above, Galaxy GT430 with custom Zalman VNF100, Optical Drive moved forward for photo shot.
The end of the upper pipe of the twin-pipe section abuts the ICE fan guard a bit as the Drive Bay Cage stops any further movement.



3. ASUS Xonar out, notice the minimal clearance for upper Heat-exchange pipe between rear end of Video card and Drive Bay Cage.
It "just fits".



4. Galaxy GT430 - Zalman VNF100 on side (with ties removed from the single Heat-exchange pipe fins)
- Distance from Hacksaw cut to lower pipe ~ 17mm, single pipe to cut ~ 30mm.



5. Galaxy GT430 - Zalman VNF100 in vertical position, note the Zalman's had all of the lower fins removed from the GPU Heat-sink top cover to clear PCIe connector, it is made of very low quality aluminum and breaks easily).



Food for thought?

Depends on where your 4670 GPU is situated if you want to do it with the VNF100.

I'm guessing you'll need to go over-the-top for your longer 4670 in either a two or three section arrangement with the fins either fully athwart ships or a combo orientation.

Cheers.

[Edit: - Reduced Photo sizes]

[Sklathill]

That's pretty useful!  Man, if only my 4670 was that short.

Right now, I'm playing with putting part of the heatsink close to the case, since the 1x slot is occupied by a very small firewire card, then putting the other heatsink between the drive cage and case fan.  Haven't quite done that, since I'm now going ahead and installing all this software that needs to be installed right now!

I ended up gutting through the heatsink fins with a snipper designed for cutting fiber optic cable.  Had no problems with that...

Thanks for the images.  Super useful info!

[marcospin]

there is a new bios vers. 115  http://global.shuttle.com/products/productsDownload?productId=1477&panelId=1
Is there a risk to install it with a Xeon E3 under the hood ?

[tartin]

there is a new bios vers. 115  http://global.shuttle.com/products/productsDownload?productId=1477&panelId=1
Is there a risk to install it with a Xeon E3 under the hood ?

Hey marcospin,

Updated my SH67H3 with the Xeon E3-1230 from 107 to 115 with the W64 SH67H000.exe version.

No problems yet.