Intake to compliment blowhole. A good idea?

[Zut50]

I wanna put a blowhole at the back on the top (standard place, above the ICE) but then I got to thinking where is it getting its air from?

So then I though of adding a second fan near the front at the bottom to suck cool air in.

Is this a good idea, and will it result in a nice airflow, or will it just screw the whole thing up!

[Zut50]

Intake to compliment blowhole. A good idea?

[Quamen]

an active intake is a good thing. Stock standard all the shuttle's have is active exhausts. One on the PSU and the main fan on the ICE system. The only was the shuttle gets air for these two fans to blow out is via the holes on the side of the shuttle.  So any active intake should help feed the system with more fresh air, thus reducing the amount of old warm air recirculating in the system.

[3balls]

quamen.......if you look closely, there are intake holes on the bottom of the shuttle at the very front....hence they give you those god ugly feet with the system.  the idea being to elevate the front to allow better intake airflow.  

[Quamen]

Yea I saw them. But my point still stands. An active intake would still help a lot.

[3balls]

based on the size of the intake holes, i don't think the trade off between efficiency and noise would be worth it....my .02$

there are better methods to deal with the temp's.......of course, any mod's are encouraged.

i would certainly be interested in the results of a fan located there.

[Quamen]

hmmmm an intake fan just sitting in there would be useless. My suggestion was for a proper intake. As in a hole cut out on the front so that there is nothing impeding the airflow.

[UglyShoes]

leave it the way it is,   the current design forces air to be drawn up and over components and then out. through the ICE, by changing things you mess this up.  If you give it an airhole someplace else it's not going to draw air up and thus leave dead hot air in there.   One really shouldn't add more holes to their shuttle. If it was suppose to have more it would.   There is design around the way it is.    

Airflow through a case is not about big openings or lots of fans,  it's about air moving where it should.    When you put a big hole in the side of a shuttle you kill this since air will take path of least resistance.  so then you get dead air in there.  If you add fans then your just messing with the airflow completely and have fans fighting each other and so forth.

Shuttles are designed to meet the specs they need.   If your computer is overheating you have a problem, and it isn't do to bad cooling design.  Something is broken or not right.

[Zut50]

This is what i was afraid of. I don't want to overwpoer the existing flow of air and screw up the effectiveness of the ICE and a so forth! But should it be possible, with VERY careful positioning of a fan, to amplify the cooling that already goes on?

Hmm, I'll make a diagram to explain what I mean!

Surely if you follow the flow of air through the case,and just give it a push in the direction it is already going... theroetically of course, I dont know if it can be done in a shuttle.

I'll get on that diagram (althoughI have work to do , ill do it later today)

[Fathead]

An intake fan will reduce system temps for certain, but the following all important fact must be met:

AIR IN must equal AIR OUT!  Or Air out, must be greater than Air in!


Having to much air being pulled into the case will result in the air remaining inside the case, warming and thus causing general temps to rise.

A solution.  Use a low CFM fan to draw air in, and ensure the rear ICE has a higher CFM.  Alternativly use a PCI slot blower to remove excess air.

I will be installing a 60mm Papst fan at the front right of the case to draw air in, I have an Akasa 7 volt modded PCI blower at the rear which I use to compliment my Panaflo ICE.

[Zut50]

OK, here it is...


Right side and front view.

Green marks proposed fans. The one at the top will blow air out, and the one at the front will suck air in.

Surely if the overall airflow follows the yellow arrows then all is well.

If the intake sucked in more air than couldbe extracted by the two blowing fans, then cool air wouldbe pushed out ofthe vent holes and the whole thing would crap up.
BUT, like fathead says, surely if the exhaust pumped more than the intake gathered, then cool air would be sucked in the vent holes, and the airflow would be good, leaving no dead air.

I also wanna use a zalman northbridge cooler, so having moving air up front would be benneficial.

Fathead: Does a fan actually fit at the front on the right (like on the diagram)?

[Fathead]

Yes mate, but the actual fitting is something you'll have to work on!  The obvious idea is put the fan directly on to the case lid, but this may causes problems with lead length, motherboard header useage & also ease of getting the lid off!

Personally I am working on a plate of sorts which I can mount inside the case and fit the fan to.

A 60mm fan will fit no problem if you tidy your wires right.  An 80mm fan may even fit, in fact it probably will.

The front intake shows great results at cooling the NB, HDD & Ram and can even be effective for dropping temps around the Graphics card and CPU.  I agin have to stress get the air out!  I'm using a Slot blower which does the job very well - air is moving in a straight through direction.

[josephclemente]

Additional fans don't even have to be intake... Imagine the action those vent holes get when every fan is working as exhaust! I say try it both ways and compare.

[Zut50]

Woo! Im starting to LOVE this idea now. I suppose as long as my intake fan has a lower CFM than my exhaust, then I'm OK!

fathead: Ah yes, a mounting plate. What about a plate that fits to the bottom and front, and with an arm reachig to the top,so there are no loose edges. Im guessing that reducing vibrations (and shaking if its only fixed on two edges) will help with noise etc...

josephclemente: the way I see it, there can be only so many exhausts before you reach a kind of bottleneck, where you're asking more of passive vent holes than they can give. With three exhaust fans (including ICE), the turbulance through those vents would make the system loud! (I think )

Now to search for 60mm fans. Just Papst and Vantec Stealth so far, but I'm still looking... (id like a *little* more throughput than the Papst!)

[Fathead]

Zut50 how are you for noise?  I have two Mitsubishi 60mm's sat in front of me, one I plan on using myself the other your welcome to purchase of me if you wanted - I do have to say though, although quiet there is an electrical buzz from both of them.

The choice is yours.

[Fathead]

As for mounting the fan, I'm thinking along the same lines as you.  Some sort of plate that will fix to the HDD cage, motherboard mounting screw & the fron of the case - this should mean its supported by all sides.  I'll add some padding around the fan, and add gromets around the screws.

Working on some nice custom fan grills to complete the fan hole

[Zut50]

Ahem, I don't actually have a Shuttle!

I've had my eye on one for ages, but I'm wait for the 250W PSU. I'm thinkin'...

SB65G2
P4C 3Ghz, 2x512Mb Kingston HyperX DDR, Seagate 7200.7 120Gb HDD, CDRW/DVD, and use my crappy old GFX card until Half Life 2 is released!

[I'd like a raptor, but theyre too small. and i wont have room for 2 HDD after my mods I (dont think!)...]

and then...
Replace PSU with quiet 250W model.
Cut out grills on ICE & PSU, & replace with wire ones
CoolerMaster optical drive bezelthing
Vantec Nexus 305 Rheobus & Cathode Controller
2x10" Blue cold cathode tubes
Replace one of the rheostats in the Nexus with 5V-12V rheostat (rather than 0V-12V!), for ICE fan
Replace stock ICE fan with Papst 8412NG (40CFM, 32dB)
Add exhaust at top over ICE, Papst 8412NGML (26CFM, 19dB), on custom mounting plate
Add intake on right side near front, 60mm (), also on custom mounting plate

The Nexus rheobus is because I want a quiet system, but I'm paranoid, and would rather rely on hardware (more than Windows!), and would like to cooling power to fall back on.

I'd also like to put an LCD on the front, but I'm pretty sure this lot ^ will eat all my cash up!

ANYWAY! I digress!

Because of the fan controler, I wondered if there is a higher CFM 60mm fan, as I can easily turn it up or down. (Not a TORNADO though, hehe)
What is the throughput like on the Mitsubishi?

Also, can the papst start from 0V?

[LoRDZiM]

I have a similar plan that is half way there.  


Fans:
80mm Sunon Tornado @7v
60mm Y.S. Tech
2x 60mm Slim (from stock AMD HS)

What i have done so far:
img 1

img 2

Current idle temps (from MBM5 as i'm typing this):
CPU 38C
PSU 34C
MoBo 33C

Full Load (from MBM5 after an hour of game play):
CPU 44C
PSU 36C
MoBo 35C
 

[Zut50]

NICE setup! I love the HS . Your temps are amazing!

What the sound/airflow like from your 7V-ed Tornado?

I definatley think intakes will help there, as they will draw air through that HS, and out the tornado. And they'll blow straight onto the ram and chipset, a kind of crossflowey effect; quite effective I understand.

[LoRDZiM]

my 60mm Y.S. Tech is louder than my tornado now, but even though the tornado is running at 7volts it still pumps out lots of air.  I bet if i put it on wheels it would take off.

[Fathead]

Quote
Originally posted by: LoRDZiM
I have a similar plan that is half way there.  





Fans:

80mm Sunon Tornado @7v

60mm Y.S. Tech

2x 60mm Slim (from stock AMD HS)



What i have done so far:

img 1



img 2



Current idle temps (from MBM5 as i'm typing this):

CPU 38C

PSU 34C

MoBo 33C



Full Load (from MBM5 after an hour of game play):

CPU 44C

PSU 36C

MoBo 35C

Indeed interesting setup, but the loss of the ICE pipe in exchange for a 80mm fan and heatsink wouldn't be for me.  My early test showed that with the 60mm front intake my temps at IDLE were as low as 34C.  

[MTP]

I added a 50mm hole above the ICE t oact as an intake for the ICE.
I did a full experiment using a cardboard case I created that had removeable holes on all 3 sides.  I then ran multiple test logging the temps using mbm5.

This help me determine the best location for the hole.
It really lowered my temps and keeps the ICE fan from reving up as fast as it can pull cool air into the case verses pulling it from the inside the case.

I have a thread in here about the testing I did.

[Zut50]

Mmm, sounds nice!

Is that such that the ICE fan is pushing cool air through the ICE heatsinkygrillything at the back? rather than hot air from inside the case?

Sounds worthy of serious consideration.

However I also want air moving at the front of the case, and an intake/exhaust there would (with the above setup) would cause problems, would it not.

Maybe have two fans at the front, one on each side, one an intake, one an exhaust, to pull air straight through the case. That would probably create nasty turbulencem and dead air the center.

Hmmm, I'm confused now! (oh well, wouldn't be the first time!)

[MTP]

no my fan is setup so that it pulls air from the case not push.  My fan is on the outside of the case.

This gives more area in the case and allows it to pull air from outside the case threw the ice and back out of case.

I also have drilled holes into the 3.5 inch drive bay cover.  This allows for a slight airflow increase from the front of the case towards the rear from the ice fan.



pictures
more pictures

[DannagE]

Why not make the fans above the ice suck into the case so that the air comes into the case and around the system and also out the cpu fan cooling the cpu better.

The cpu fan works better on lowest possible speed like this so more air goes around the system firstly.

Works well for me